Avoiding Babylon

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Everything feels louder than it should, and somehow less real at the same time. That’s the tension we sit with as Dr. Haugen (Dr. Deep State) joins us to talk about spectacle, propaganda, and the slow spiritual cost of living inside an attention economy that never stops asking for your fear, your outrage, and your loyalty.

We dig into the core idea behind his new book, Saints of the Apocalypse: the apocalypse can look like distraction, not just disaster. From political theater and mass persuasion to the way online narratives “train” desire, we ask what discernment looks like when the world feels scripted. We also connect this to Catholic theology and typology, including St. Stephen, the Church’s historical memory, and how different readings of Romans 9–11 shape conversations about ecumenism and modern religious identity.

From there, we turn to the interior battle: hypocrisy as religious performance without divine content, the temptation to trade truth for comfort, and the urgent need to learn how to suffer well. We close by touching big themes Dr. Haugen explores elsewhere, including AI, the metaverse as a modern Tower of Babel, and Fatima as a warning against confusion that masquerades as peace.

If this conversation helps you see the spectacle more clearly, subscribe, share it with a friend, and leave a review so more people can find it. What part of modern life feels most like “theater” to you right now?
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A single rumor from Rome can light the fuse again: is Pope Leo quietly trying to de-escalate the fight over the Traditional Latin Mass and stop turning Catholic liturgy into a battlefield? We start with the latest chatter around easing hostility toward TLM communities after Traditionis Custodes, then zoom out to the deeper question: what does fidelity look like when Church politics, social media, and constant scandals train us to pick teams instead of pursuing holiness?

We also get honest about how online Catholic drama warps the soul. The temptation is to draw hard lines, label people, and turn “calling out” leaders into a sport. We push back on that impulse and talk about why cohesion matters, especially if the cultural weather keeps shifting toward real hostility. The point isn’t to pretend everything is fine. The point is to stay in the Church, stay near the sacraments, and refuse to let rage replace judgment.

From there we dig into Scripture and history, including Genesis 3:15 and the theme of spiritual conflict, plus why the liturgy itself keeps forcing these questions back onto the table especially as we head into Holy Week and the Triduum. We react to a clip about a young adult stumbling into a reverent Mass and realizing, “This is what I’ve been missing,” and we ask what that says about worship, culture, and the future of Catholic life.

If this kind of deep Catholic commentary helps you think clearly, subscribe, share the show with a friend, and leave a review. And if you want the extra segments and early access to upcoming guest conversations, join us on Locals.
Support the show

Need seafood for Lent? Check out https://shoplobster.com/ and use code AB10 to get 10% from Maine's ONLY Catholic lobster company.

Check out our new sponsor, Nic Nac, at www.nicnac.com and use code "AB25%" for 25% off of your first order!

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A husband posts that his wife “was formerly promiscuous” and he “was a virgin,” and somehow we’re all expected to nod along like it’s spiritual content. That moment opens a bigger problem we can’t ignore: testimony culture is starting to look like confession-as-branding, where past sin becomes a credential and conversion becomes a content strategy.

We dig into what this does to the moral imagination, especially for younger Christians who grew up trying to live faithfully. When dramatic stories get rewarded, it quietly teaches that holiness is boring and that wreckage is a prerequisite for meaning. We talk about repentance versus performance, the temptation toward antinomian thinking, and why public scandal isn’t erased by a quick “sorry” when real harm was done.

Then we pivot to the political-theology fight blowing up online: Catholic integralism, natural law, religious liberty, and why figures like Scott Hahn are suddenly getting name-dropped as threats on mainstream shows. We react to the Eric Metaxas clip with James Lindsay and John Zmirak, clarify what integralism actually claims about the relationship between temporal power and spiritual authority, and challenge the “we don’t impose morality” line that collapses the moment you remember that every law encodes a moral vision.

We also connect the dots to the convert boom narrative, Zionism pressure, Gaza framing, and the way “anti-Semitism” gets used as a debate-ending weapon. We read and respond to public statements in the Carrie Prejean Boller controversy and Bishop Robert Barron’s response, emphasizing the need to condemn real racism while refusing to treat all criticism of Israel, Judaism, or public behavior as hatred. If you want clearer categories, sharper definitions, and less propaganda in Christian discourse, this one is for you. Subscribe, share the show, and leave a review, then tell us what you think: where should Christians draw the line in public speech?
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Need seafood for Lent? Check out https://shoplobster.com/ and use code AB10 to get 10% from Maine's ONLY Catholic lobster company.

Check out our new sponsor, Nic Nac, at www.nicnac.com and use code "AB25%" for 25% off of your first order!

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One bad Mass can haunt you for years. So can one truly reverent one that finally makes the Catholic faith click.

We sit down with Catholic Esquire to trace the path a lot of serious Catholics have quietly taken: from lukewarm Novus Ordo parish life, to apologetics and “doing all the programs,” to the shock of realizing how much the liturgy forms what we believe about sin, sacrifice, and the Eucharist. We talk about the Traditional Latin Mass not as nostalgia, but as a place where the prayers and posture teach the faith with force and clarity.

COVID comes up as the accelerant. When parishes shut down Mass and delayed sacraments, many people stopped trusting the idea that everything was fine and started seeking a community that would protect a sacramental life. From drive-through confessions to Communion policies that felt irreverent, we unpack why 2020 pushed people “full trad” and why even defenders of the status quo still end up parish-shopping for reverence.

Then we go big: Vatican II, religious liberty, ecumenism, and the social kingship of Christ. We explore why these debates connect to the current Catholic crisis, why sedevacantism arguments keep growing, why the SSPX question won’t go away, and how online “trad wars” can destroy charity if we let them. If you’re trying to raise a family, keep the faith, and think clearly about authority, this conversation is for you.

Subscribe for more conversations like this, share it with a friend who’s wrestling with the same questions, and leave a review with the biggest point you disagreed with.
Support the show

Need seafood for Lent? Check out https://shoplobster.com/ and use code AB10 to get 10% from Maine's ONLY Catholic lobster company.

Check out our new sponsor, Nic Nac, at www.nicnac.com and use code "AB25%" for 25% off of your first order!

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https://www.avoidingbabylon.com

Merchandise:  https://avoiding-babylon-shop.fourthwall.com

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Want to reach out to us? Want to leave a comment or review? Want to give us a suggestion or berate Anthony? Send us a text by clicking this link!
Christian Zionism sounds “Bible based” until you actually follow the Bible’s own rules for reading the Bible. We start with the claim that many Christians were taught: God still has a separate covenant with Israel, modern return to the land fulfills prophecy, and end times can’t happen without it. Then we put that claim under the light of the New Testament and the result is uncomfortable but clarifying: Christ is the fulfillment of the law and prophets, not a footnote to them.

We walk through the covenant story in detail, from the split of the northern kingdom and the lost tribes to Paul’s argument in Romans 9–11 about God’s promises and the ingrafting of the nations. From there we dig into one of the most fascinating “hidden in plain sight” connections in Scripture: Hosea 2’s betrothal promise, 2 Kings 17’s five nations, and Jesus at the well in John 4. The point isn’t trivia. It’s a blueprint for how fulfillment works in Christ, right now, through the New Covenant.

We also open Isaiah 42 and Isaiah 49 to show the Servant as a light to the Gentiles, given as a covenant, with the coastlands waiting for his Torah, not a continued reliance on Mosaic categories as the final word. Along the way we challenge the fixation on earthly Jerusalem using Galatians 4 and Revelation’s stark language, then land the plane in Matthew’s vineyard parable and Jesus’ warnings about covenant judgment. Whether you’re Catholic, Orthodox, or Protestant, if you care about biblical theology, Israel and the Church, end times claims, and how to interpret prophecy without forcing modern politics into the text, you’ll get a lot out of this conversation.

If this helped you rethink a long held assumption, subscribe, share it with a friend who’s confident about “Israel prophecy,” and leave a review with the verse you think matters most.
Support the show

Need seafood for Lent? Check out https://shoplobster.com/ and use code AB10 to get 10% from Maine's ONLY Catholic lobster company.

Check out our new sponsor, Nic Nac, at www.nicnac.com and use code "AB25%" for 25% off of your first order!

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https://www.avoidingbabylon.com

Merchandise:  https://avoiding-babylon-shop.fourthwall.com

Locals Community: https://avoidingbabylon.locals.com

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