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Professor John Norton has spent decades dismantling the hidden assumptions in physics from Newton’s determinism to the myth of Landauer’s Principle. In this episode, he explains why causation may not be real, how classical physics breaks down, and why even Einstein got some things wrong. If you’re ready to rethink the foundations of science, this one’s essential.
Join My New Substack (Personal Writings): https://curtjaimungal.substack.com
Listen on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/4gL14b92xAErofYQA7bU4e
Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction
03:37 Norton's Dome Explained
06:30 The Misunderstanding of Determinism
09:31 Thermodynamics and Infinite Systems
14:39 Implications for Quantum Mechanics
16:20 Revisiting Causation
18:15 Critique of Causal Metaphysics
20:21 The Utility of Causal Language
24:58 Exploring Thought Experiments
33:05 Landauer's Principle Discussion
49:48 Critique of Experimental Validation
52:25 Consequences for Maxwell's Demon
1:13:34 Einstein's Critiques of Quantum Mechanics
1:28:16 The Nature of Scientific Discovery
1:42:56 Inductive Inferences in Science
Links Mentioned:
• A Primer on Determinism (book): https://amzn.to/45Jn3b4
• John Norton’s papers: https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=UDteMFoAAAAJ
• Causation as Folk Science (paper): https://sites.pitt.edu/~jdnorton/papers/003004.pdf
• Lipschitz continuity (wiki): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lipschitz_continuity
• The Dome: An Unexpectedly Simple Failure of Determinism (paper): https://philsci-archive.pitt.edu/2943/1/Norton.pdf
• Norton’s Dome (wiki): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norton%27s_dome
• Approximation and Idealization (paper): https://sites.pitt.edu/~jdnorton/papers/Ideal_Approx_final.pdf
• On the Quantum Theory of Radiation (paper): https://www.informationphilosopher.com/solutions/scientists/einstein/1917_Radiation.pdf
• Making Things Happen (book): https://ccc.inaoep.mx/~esucar/Clases-mgc/Making-Things-Happen-A-Theory-of-Causal-Explanation.pdf
• Causation in Physics (wiki): https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/causation-physics/
• Laboratory of the Mind (paper): https://www.academia.edu/2644953/REVIEW_James_R_Brown_Laboratory_of_the_Mind
• Roger Penrose on TOE: https://youtu.be/sGm505TFMbU
• Ted Jacobson on TOE: https://youtu.be/3mhctWlXyV8
• The Thermodynamics of Computation (paper): https://sites.cc.gatech.edu/computing/nano/documents/Bennett%20-%20The%20Thermodynamics%20Of%20Computation.pdf
• What’s Actually Possible? (article): https://curtjaimungal.substack.com/p/the-unexamined-in-principle
• On a Decrease of Entropy in a Thermodynamic System (paper): https://fab.cba.mit.edu/classes/862.22/notes/computation/Szilard-1929.pdf
• Landauer’s principle and thermodynamics (article): https://www.nature.com/articles/nature10872
• The Logical Inconsistency of Old Quantum Theory of Black Body Radiation (paper): https://sites.pitt.edu/~jdnorton/papers/Inconsistency_OQT.pdf
SUPPORT:
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1:55:13
Top Physicists Call Out Many Worlds As Nonsense | Jacob Barandes Λ Emily Adlam
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Top physicists Emily Adlam and Jacob Barandes deliver a powerful takedown of the Many Worlds Interpretation. In this episode, they expose why it’s more philosophical fantasy than scientific theory, revealing its lack of testability, predictive power, and real-world grounding. If you’ve ever questioned whether parallel universes are legitimate physics or just sci-fi masquerading as science, this conversation will challenge everything.
As a listener of TOE you can get a special 20% off discount to The Economist and all it has to offer! Visit https://www.economist.com/toe
Join My New Substack (Personal Writings): https://curtjaimungal.substack.com
Watch on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/4gL14b92xAErofYQA7bU4e
Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction
01:08 Philosophical Foundations of Quantum Mechanics
3:22 The Nature of Self-Identity
10:59 Exploring Branching Universes
12:54 Collaboration Between Physicists and Philosophers
16:51 Understanding Probability and Credence
29:12 The Role of Indexicals in Consciousness
36:36 Causation and Its Implications
45:45 Disagreement on Personal Identity
51:03 The Hard Problem of Consciousness
1:00:35 Reflections on Conscious Experience
1:08:05 Concluding Thoughts on Mind and Identity
1:08:48 Time and Mind
1:09:09 The Concept of the World Line
1:14:43 Active Consciousness and Agency
1:19:12 The Hard Problem of Consciousness
1:36:15 Emergence in Physics
1:55:46 Speculation vs. Rigorous Argument
2:06:13 Philosophy's Contribution to Physics
2:12:43 Bridging Philosophy and Physics
Links Mentioned:
• Emily’s first appearance on TOE: https://youtu.be/6I2OhmVWLMs
• Emily’s profile: https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Emily-Adlam
• Jacob’s first appearance on TOE: https://youtu.be/7oWip00iXbo
• Jacob’s website: https://www.jacobbarandes.com/
• Jacob Barandes on TOE: https://youtu.be/YaS1usLeXQM
• Against Self-Location (paper): https://arxiv.org/pdf/2409.05259
• Eddy Chen & Barry Loewer on TOE: https://youtu.be/xZnafO__IZ0
• Julian Barbour on TOE: https://youtu.be/bprxrGaf0Os
• Robert Sapolsky on TOE: https://youtu.be/z0IqA1hYKY8
• Curt’s Consciousness Iceberg: https://youtu.be/65yjqIDghEk
• Iain McGilchrist on TOE: https://youtu.be/Q9sBKCd2HD0
• Stories of Your Life and Others (book): https://www.amazon.com/dp/1101972122
• Matt Segall on TOE: https://youtu.be/DeTm4fSXpbM
• TOE’s Free Will compilation: https://youtu.be/SSbUCEleJhg
• Manolis Kellis & Jacob Barandes debate: https://youtu.be/MTD8xkbiGis
• “The Incompatibility of Free Will and Determinism” (paper): https://iweb.langara.ca/rjohns/files/2013/01/van_inwagen.pdf
• After Physics (book): https://www.amazon.com/dp/067497087X
• Michael Levin on TOE: https://youtu.be/c8iFtaltX-s
SUPPORT:
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2:22:22
The God Crutch: Do The Laws of Physics Exist?
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Are the laws of physics governing forces or elegant summaries? In this deep and often humorous debate, Barry Loewer of Rutgers and Eddy Chen of UC San Diego clash over the very nature of physical reality. Are the laws of nature real, mind independent constraints that shape what’s possible or are they human made descriptions of observed patterns? Together they explore metaphysics, causation, probability, and whether the universe is truly ruled by anything at all. A must watch for anyone questioning the foundations of science itself.
Join My New Substack (Personal Writings): https://curtjaimungal.substack.com
Listen on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/4gL14b92xAErofYQA7bU4e
Timestamps:
00:00 The Nature of Physical Reality
42:28 The Circularity of Scientific Understanding
1:05:44 Reality Explored
1:08:28 Describing Human Experience
1:10:10 The Role of Science
1:10:58 Understanding Motion and Laws
1:12:19 The Nature of Laws
1:14:55 Possible Worlds in Philosophy
1:18:05 Configuration Space Debate
1:21:10 Quantum Mechanics and Reality
1:22:50 Metaphysical Necessity
1:27:13 The Nature of Free Will
1:30:14 Bridging Philosophy and Science
1:32:05 Constraints and Freedom
1:34:57 Philosophical Disputes
1:39:08 The Journey of Learning
2:05:16 Teaching and Learning Dynamics
2:07:23 Closing Reflections
Links Mentioned:
• Barry’s published papers: https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=n_RTOwO00oEC&hl=en
• Eddy’s published papers: https://arxiv.org/a/chen_e_1.html
• Neil Turok on TOE: https://youtu.be/ZUp9x44N3uE
• Greg Chaitin on TOE: https://youtu.be/zMPnrNL3zsE
• Leonard Susskind on TOE: https://youtu.be/2p_Hlm6aCok
• Emily Adlam on TOE: https://youtu.be/6I2OhmVWLMs
• Laws of Nature and Chances (book): https://www.amazon.com/Laws-Nature-Chances-Breathes-Equations/dp/0198907699
• Laws of Physics (book): https://www.amazon.com/Laws-Physics-Elements-Philosophy/dp/100901272X/ref=sr_1_1?crid=1CHA72RYFUOI8&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.OjkhTXRzZw_SWTMFZp8dUtREsTxacKuwg03AsLUUp6qLCuygS74CtEgujWl7wMvVEt-ErFEz-CfFLiiXTmuUCwKq0TW4WLFIA3DIhDNVaV4.gRuqaZldjUa8Kv_j1ew-CfZGQqtdt00X55fyMZ9NGD4&dib_tag=se&keywords=eddy+chen&qid=1749667626&s=books&sprefix=eddy+chen%2Cstripbooks%2C128&sr=1-1
• On the Plurality of Worlds (book): https://www.amazon.com/Plurality-Worlds-David-K-Lewis/dp/0631224262
• Tim Maudlin on TOE: https://youtu.be/fU1bs5o3nss
• Tim Maudlin and Tim Palmer on TOE: https://youtu.be/883R3JlZHXE
• How Physics Makes Us Free (book): https://www.amazon.com/How-Physics-Makes-Us-Free/dp/0190269448
• From Time Asymmetry to Quantum Entanglement (paper): https://arxiv.org/pdf/2006.05029
• Jacob Barandes on TOE: https://youtu.be/7oWip00iXbo
• Realism with a Human Face (book): https://www.amazon.com/Realism-Human-Face-Hilary-Putnam/dp/0674749456
• Causation and Laws of Nature in Early Modern Philosophy (book): https://www.amazon.com/Causation-Nature-Early-Modern-Philosophy/dp/0199664684/ref=tmm_pap_swatch_0
• The Maniac (book): https://www.amazon.com/MANIAC-Benjamin-Labatut/dp/0593654471
• When We Cease to Understand the World (book): https://www.amazon.com/When-We-Cease-Understand-World/dp/1681375664
• Eddy’s paper on time and nature: https://arxiv.org/pdf/2109.09226
SUPPORT:
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2:19:00
The Theory That Shatters Language Itself
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Professor Elan Barenholtz, cognitive scientist at Florida Atlantic University, joins TOE to discuss one of the most unsettling ideas in cognitive science: that language is a self-contained, autoregressive system with no inherent connection to the external world. In this mind-altering episode, he explains why AI’s mastery of language without meaning forces us to rethink the nature of mind, perception, and reality itself...
Join My New Substack (Personal Writings): https://curtjaimungal.substack.com
Listen on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/4gL14b92xAErofYQA7bU4e
Timestamps:
00:00 The Mind and Language Connection
02:09 The Grounded Thesis of Language
09:29 The Epiphany of Language
13:06 The Dichotomy of Language and Perception
16:24 Language as an Autonomous System
19:48 The Problem of Qualia and Language
23:35 Bridging Language and Action
31:32 Exploring Embeddings in Language
38:21 The Platonic Space of Language
44:17 The Challenges of Meaning and Action
51:05 Understanding the Complexity of Color
52:53 The Paradox of Language Describing Itself
58:19 The Map of Language and Action
1:07:48 Continuous Learning in Language Models
1:11:46 The Nature of Memory
1:22:46 The Role of Context
1:32:18 Exploring Language Dynamics
1:39:44 The Shift from Oral to Written Language
2:11:34 Language and the Cosmic Whole
2:21:35 Reflections on Existence
Links Mentioned:
• Elan’s Substack: https://elanbarenholtz.substack.com
• Elan's X / Twitter: https://x.com/ebarenholtz
• Geoffrey Hinton on TOE: https://youtu.be/b_DUft-BdIE
• Joscha Bach and Ben Goertzel on TOE: https://youtu.be/xw7omaQ8SgA
• Elan’s published papers: https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=2grAjZsAAAAJ
• Ai medical panel on TOE: https://youtu.be/abzXzPBW4_s
• Jacob Barandes and Manolis Kellis on TOE: https://youtu.be/MTD8xkbiGis
• Will Hahn on TOE: https://youtu.be/3fkg0uTA3qU
• Noam Chomsky on TOE: https://youtu.be/DQuiso493ro
• Greg Kondrak on TOE: https://youtu.be/FFW14zSYiFY
• Andres Emilsson on TOE: https://youtu.be/BBP8WZpYp0Y
• Harnessing the Universal Geometry of Embeddings (paper): https://arxiv.org/pdf/2505.12540
• Yang-Hui He on TOE: https://youtu.be/spIquD_mBFk
• Iain McGilchrist on TOE: https://youtu.be/Q9sBKCd2HD0
• Curt interviews ChatGPT: https://youtu.be/mSfChbMRJwY
• Empiricism and the Philosophy of Mind (book): https://www.amazon.com/dp/0674251555
• Karl Friston on TOE: https://youtu.be/uk4NZorRjCo
• Michael Levin and Anna Ciaunica on TOE: https://youtu.be/2aLhkm6QUgA
• The Biology of LLMs (paper): https://transformer-circuits.pub/2025/attribution-graphs/biology.html
• Jacob Barandes on TOE: https://youtu.be/YaS1usLeXQM
• Emily Adlam on TOE: https://youtu.be/6I2OhmVWLMs
• Julian Barbour on TOE: https://youtu.be/bprxrGaf0Os
• Tim Palmer on TOE: https://youtu.be/vlklA6jsS8A
• Neil Turok on TOE: https://youtu.be/ZUp9x44N3uE
• Jayarāśi Bhaṭṭa: https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/jayaraasi/
• On the Origin of Time (book): https://www.amazon.com/dp/0593128443
SUPPORT:
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2:32:19
What is “Energy,” Actually?
Veritasium pointed out that energy isn't conserved, but here I argue something further: energy is not even well-defined!
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SUPPORT:
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- Support me on Patreon: https://patreon.com/curtjaimungal
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Exploring theoretical physics, consciousness, Ai, and God in a technically rigorous manner. If you'd like to support this endeavor, then please visit the Patreon ( https://patreon.com/curtjaimungal ). Thank you for your charitable and kindhearted support. My name's Curt Jaimungal, a Torontonian with a degree in mathematical physics from the University of Toronto and I analyze various Theories of Everything from this analytic perspective, though more and more opening up to alternative approaches. The separating factor of TOE from other podcasts is its focus on depth even at the risk of limiting the audience due to how much detail we delve into subjects. Paralleling the intensity found in academic discourse, we're increasingly embracing a spectrum of unconventional ideas to conduct research during this podcast, rather than merely conveying existing information. Contact toe [at] indiefilmTO [dot] com for business inquiries / sponsorship.